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Interview Series Part 3. Brent Hayman
Raincity Grill (map)
1193 Denman St
(604) 685-7337
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A Chat with Brent Hayman
a wine blog / interview series joint feature

By Daniel Fishman
Eat Vancouver Writer
Tuesday, July 10th, 2006

I recently sat down with Brent Hayman, long-time general manager, and of interest to me, sommelier for Raincity Grill on Denman Street. Raincity was given an Award of Distinction from Wine Enthusiast Magazine in 2005, as well as Awards of Excellence from Wine Spectator every year from 1997-2005, among other awards. When I arrived Brent was in the middle of a tasting, and I was lucky enough to get to try them. For what it’s worth, I preferred the Bogle Chenin Blanc, although the Cline Viognier was also pretty nice.

Brent also shared with me some of his own background, his opinions on wine at Vancouver restaurants, and a bit about the business considerations that go into his wine list decisions. One of the things that interested me most was the fact that multiple restaurants and retailers often get together to order larger quantities of wines from the U.S. in order to save on shipping costs. Perhaps this explains why it seems like the same wines seem to pop-up everywhere at the same time. We also discussed whether or not BC wines have been increasing in quality as quickly as they have been increasing in price. Finally, Brent echoed the voice of my own wine instructor, urging people to trust their own tastes as opposed to the opinions of experts in the media. What follows is a transcript of our conversation, edited for length and to disguise my awkwardly worded questions.

Fishman: How about a little background information. How did you first become interested in wine?

Hayman: Well, my sister worked for the Four Seasons. And traveling in that circle, we got a taste of good wine. And for special occasions we would go to The Cannery, and we would usually drink German Rieslings, which was a change from the beer or V.O. and Seven that I was used to drinking, and that’s where I first got an inkling that I had an interest in wine.
I had planned on traveling in my early 20’s, and thought well, if I am going to travel, what’s a vocation I can take that I can use if I am in Australia or Europe or wherever, and I thought: bartender. So I took a bartending course, and the first job interview I had was at the Hyatt. Fortunately, or unfortunately, I got the job, and so I never traveled. I started attending what was then the International Wine Festival, which was held at the Hyatt. I took some classes, started going to tastings, and remembered that The Cannery had a strong wine program, so I got a job as a bartender at The Cannery, worked my way up to floor manager… and from there, it’s ancient history.
[Eventually] I wound up here at Raincity, where I have been for 11 years, as the General Manager.

Fishman: So how much of your time is spent in the role of sommelier here?

Hayman: Not enough unfortunately. I’m the general manager, and there a lot of other things that take precedence over the wine program. As a small restaurant you can’t really afford to have a sommelier on staff, unless they were also a server, and also a general manager, so I try to combine the two and it seems to work reasonably well. Sometimes the wine list isn’t updated as frequently as I would prefer.

Fishman: Do you have an overall theme to the wine list, or do you just make decisions independently for each wine?

Hayman: Well, of course the wine list is solely focused on the West Coast. When I arrived here, California was far and away the major player, and BC wine was not really on the scene yet, or in a very small way. And that has, there has been a total shift in people’s attitudes and thinking. Now British Columbia wines represent 85 or 90% of the volume of the wine we sell. As a result, we’ve had to restructure the list somewhat; we have a lot of depth in older vintages in California and Washington red wine. But that’s not how we are selling the wine, so consequently we have really backed off on purchases from South of the border, partly because the WA wines are higher priced; like in British Columbia, a lot of the wineries in WA and OR are very small scale wineries, boutique production, and they are not looking to discount their wines to have them in Canada. So they tend to be pricier, and most people aren’t willing to spend that kind of money on a regular basis for wines that may or may not be marginally better than the ones we are producing up here.

Fishman: Do you think then that BC provides better value for money?

Hayman: I think there are areas, yes, I wouldn’t say across the board necessarily. We’re seeing BC wines increase in price the last couple of years fairly dramatically. Even some of the big wineries that used to offer special pricing to restaurants, a lot of them are finding that there is such demand on their product that they’re not having to do that anymore. So, the wines are getting more expensive, and we are seeing the quality increase, but whether or not that’s keeping up with the increase in price… that’s hard to say.

Fishman: When you are looking to import wines from the U.S., are importation costs significant in affecting those prices?

Hayman: Well, there’s the government mark-ups that we all incur. If you are buying small quantities from boutique wineries then the main difference there would be shipping costs, not being able to bring it in in volume. If you are just bringing in a case or two of wine, there would be some significant costs in shipping. So in regard to bringing in a special wine, we do do a fair bit of that, but what we will do is try to partner up with other restaurants. So if I am on a trip to California, I will try to bring some samples back and meet with some of the other sommeliers or retailers and get some more people interested and do a combined order. So, if we can get together a pallet [50-56 cases] or two of wine we can keep the per-unit cost down. So there’s not a lot of orders that I will do just for the restaurant singularly.

Fishman: So what are the main factors you consider when deciding whether or not to purchase a wine for the list?

Hayman: Well, there are a lot of criteria, not the least of which is price, no matter how good the wine is, if it’s going to be priced out of reach for most people, what’s the benefit to us? We have a large list, so, I could bring in a lot of wines that would require hand selling—they are obscure, people don’t know the producer, or haven’t heard of the grape variety, who knows—but that’s a lot of work, and for what end? I have to take that into account with every wine, I might like the wine, but is it going to take an extraordinary amount of work to move it, compared to something else. Grape varieties, for example. There are those that are in vogue, and those that are not. We have always tried to pioneer, I wouldn’t say “obscure” varieties, but for example, we were doing Pinot Gris here before it was popular. It has always been a favorite variety of mine, so I’ve always kind of championed it. Same with Pinot Noir, I love pinot Noir, and I love the way it goes with food, especially our local cuisine, so we’ve done a lot with Pinot Noir over the years, before Sideways came along and made it popular. And I think, Cabernet and Chardonnay, in a lot of ways, are overdone. I know that’s kind of cliché these days, but, we’ve purposely avoided putting them on feature lists at times, just so we can slow down the sales and maybe move something else, like a Cabernet Franc or Chenin Blanc or Riesling. Because if you have a Cabernet or a Chard on there, they are going to dominate the sales.

Fishman: What do you think that your wine list offers that is missing from others in Vancouver?

Hayman: Well, based on the size of the list, and the fact that the restaurant has been here 15 years, there’s a lot of depth in terms of older vintages. They aren’t necessarily accessible to the average diner, because of the cost, but for West Coast wines we’ve got a good selection in older vintages, I think.

Fishman: Do you have a favorite wine on the list?

Hayman: I couldn’t say that I have a favorite… I like different grapes to suit different moods, different occasions, different cuisines. Pinot Noir I love, but even there, there are different styles… I rarely drink the same bottle twice. My wife is also in the wine business, so we are always trying different products.

Fishman: I take you collect at home then?

Hayman: Yes. For 20 years or more.

Fishman: And is there a focus to your collection, or is it generally fairly balanced?

Hayman: I don’t know if I would say it’s balanced. There’s a lot of Italian, a lot of French reds, for sparkling it’s dominated by Champagne.

Fishman: Since you are clearly a fan of those wines then, is it hard to limit yourself to West Coast wines only here at Raincity?

Hayman: No, not really. Because I appreciate what we have here too. And the quality, the styles are different. Because I am tasting a lot of West Coast wine here, I don’t necessarily have those wines at home, although, I will admit that, for whites, we do drink a fair bit of BC whites at home, just because of the value and that they are fresh, fruity. But for reds, we do tend towards other regions.

Fishman: One last question: Is there something that you wish the average customer knew about wine?

Hayman: I think people would do well to trust their palates. You see a lot of people coming in, Wine Spectator tucked under their arms… I have a bit of a problem with scoring wines the way they are scored and people, just sort of having blind faith in somebody like a Robert Parker, who has a very specific palate, and I don’t think those wines are necessarily for everybody. The media has a lot of power, and you see wine styles being dictated by that, and I think its unfortunate in some cases.